This is a message thread from facebook that I wanted to preserve for prosperity. The whole thing starts when I see a link on Bobby Pratt's profile (a kid I went to high school with) to a very old Ronald Reagan piece against "socialized medicine" (read Medicare) before he was involved in government. Probably paid to do it by the American Medical Association at the time. (he was an actor after all!)
Funny, that the same American Medical Association are in favor of health care reform now! Anyway, I boiled over on these folks. I'm not exactly proud of it, but I finally could not play nice any more:
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Regarding the Reagan speech:
Bobby Pratt: The first 15 seconds of this speech says it all and it's worth listening to.
Fri at 3:37pm
Jack Whitman Jr:
He did say it all. I hope people take time to listen to this one.
Fri at 4:25pm
Doug Hansel:
He was wrong and you are wrong. I lived in the UK for 8 years. The Nationial Health system there works great. I lived it. I know. I used it, and I was surrounded by others that used it. Sure, it wasn't perfect, but it was a damn site better than what we have now. You guys need a taste of unemployment like I had where I was paying $1200 ... Read Morefreaking bucks a month to cover my family with no income only a few months ago. Actually, I pray it doesn't happen to you, as no one should have to endure that.
Pay a attention and use your head. The insurance companies are the very evil that Reagan is warning against now in this video, and we can't let them continue. At least with a democratic process we "might" have some shot at controlling this crap.
Fri at 10:43pm
Cindy Doss:
Doug,
If the UK system was so good, then why is it so many people from the UK and other countrys that have socialized medicine come here to get there surgery's and other things done? Since you don't like how this county is goiing, please by all means, use our 1st amendment with pride and get the hell out with all the other demorcrats that are trying to ruin our freedom country.
Fri at 11:44pm
Barbara Buntele Karraker:
Doug, sorry to hear that you had to endure being unemployeed and afraid, but government is not the answer....most likely they were the problem....I work in health care and everyone who seeks treatment gets treatment regardless of ability to pay....People come from all over the world to seek treatment here....specially those who live where they have... Read More socialized medicine....Do you really want some bean counter telling you because you're sixty-five years young you can't have that procedure due to age?? Because that's what happens...Cancer diagnoses? Go home and be with your family..no treatment for you...Scary....Let's not let that happen here....
Sat at 12:20am
Dave Pippin:
Government is never the answer. They have one responsibility and that is to protect our freedoms. If we do not stand up now and fight this battle, we risk losing the war forever.
Sat at 8:51am
Doug Hansel:
Cindy, again, wrong. Recently, 750,000 Americans left the country to seek medical treatment abroad. See this paper and the fact that it is expected to trend into the millions! http://www.deloitte.com/dtt/article/0,1002,cid%253D230231,00.html
READ the PDF! VERY few come here and only because of rare specialty cases. You probably won't read it though since it doesn't "agree" with you.
You evoke the 1st amendment and freedom, and you deny me mine? You are a hypocrite! You want anyone that doesn't agree with you to leave! That's not how freedom and democracy works. What a way to set an example!
Yesterday at 8:17am
Doug Hansel:
Barbara, Afraid? Of ignorance, yes..
Sure "government is not the answer"; we don't need social security, medicare, police, fire, judges, legal systems. Let's get rid of all that crap shall we? And Dave just wants the military and that's it.
Where are you getting your info Barbara? From your company probably! If you want to talk about "Medical Tourism" which is what it's actually called, you should do more research before you start talking out your backside.
Here's the link again http://www.deloitte.com/dtt/article/0,1002,cid%253D230231,00.html
As I said in my previous post, I lived in the UK. I have seen the system work personally for 8 years. Guess what, there's lots of "old people" there! They don't actually kill them or deny them treatments! No REALLY!
See this article on how much the brits like their healthcare regardless of what you are being told. http://bit.ly/mAObj
If you folks would only pay attention and do your own thinking, you'd be amazed at what you can find out.
Yesterday at 8:28am
Cindy Doss:
Doug,
I did read your article and my question to you is, if you thought the UK was so great, then why did you leave? Have you seen how our Vets are treated? Do you really want a government that doesn't care about you to tell you what you can and can not do when it comes to your health and your families? Have you not paid attention to what our government is doing to this country. If I really thought that it would benefit this country, I would be all for it, but it won't, it will only make things worse. I do understand that our insurance companies have a lot to do with the problem, so it is them we need to fight, not let our government control who and when we visit our own chosen doctors. I do understand people want to go to other countries because they have services that our FDA will not approve here, that is not what our issue is, our issue is letting our government control our healthcare. Have you read this bill or any part of it, if not, read it, you will change your mind.
Yesterday at 11:48am
Doug Hansel:
Cindy, you can't back track on your statement above. We all know what you meant. "get the hell out with all the other democrats" is very plain. We know where you stand. Don't be ashamed, I'm sure some others here agree with you, just don't play like you didn't "mean to say that" Because that's BS.
I think you need to go back and examine why this country is so great. Why is that Cindy? How is our fragile democracy that you so cherise held together? It's the government baby.. by the people for the people. It's precisely our government, that we create and re-create through our democratic process that gives you your precious freedoms.
But, the government is EVIL isn't? Answer me this: Do you "Cindy" want to get rid of Medicare, Social Security, police, fire, judges, legal system, and education? Do you? Because these are exactly the "social" systems that you are yours are fighting against. You wouldn't know socialism if it hit you. Please try and LEARN before joining the debate
Yesterday at 2:16pm
Doug Hansel:
and YES, I have read parts of the bill, and I'm glad you asked, because so far you have not offered one fact from it to back up your outrageous claims. Please, if you can quote one line from the bill that backs up your opinion, I would love for you to share it. I'm sure we all would.
Yesterday at 2:20pm
Barbara Buntele Karraker:
Doug, sorry you seem so very angry...everyone has there right to their opinions...I work on a Bone Marrow Transpalnt unit....This is a very expensive treatment & we currently has several pt with only Medicare and Medicaide for insurance....I work with 2 RN's from the UK and 1 from Canada....All 3 say that they would never be treating some of the patients we do....mostly do to age....so be gald you were young & whatever treatment you recieved while living in the UK was not age based.....I read your article....some minor treatments and drugs maybe cheaper elsewhere...we have the best health care in the World right here....You say you've read some of the 1000 page bill?? I can't seem to find a copy...I see blogs and what people on both sides want you to know...but I can't seem to find the bill itself...if you have the wab site for that I would love to read it.....Insurance companies do need to be reigned in and some do crazy lawsuits that drive up the cost of everything medical.....
9 hours ago
Barbara Buntele Karraker:
Remember it's called a medical practice...not a medical perfect.....good Doctors, Nurses and Other Medical Professionals practice good medicine....they are not perfect...they do the best they can...
Doug Hansel:
Barbara,
If I'm angry, it's because people are lying. Don't you get mad when people lie and distort facts?
You are working in a very specialized area, and I'm sure the doctors you work with are the best at what they do, but we're talking about millions of people that do not have health insurance here. You need to widen your view of the situation beyond your practice. How many people come into your practice from overseas per year? You're talking about a handful, and the rest of us are talking about millions of people without basic care.
I also think you are getting confused about what the debate is about. No one is criticizing the quality of health care in this country. We are talking about the insurance industry and the way health care is administered. We are not critical of YOU. Did you think we were?
I'm very surprised that you can't find a copy of this bill, since it's kind of a easy thing to find. I hope your nursing skills are better than your google skills!
8 hours ago
Barbara Buntele Karraker:
Doug, I realize that some people seek treatment outside the USA because it's not an approved treatment here..... Socialized Medicine isn't going to change the FDA and their rules..... Waiting for the link to the bill..... Even though we are on opposite sides of this issue..... I hope things are going well for you and have found a good job.... It's Great to be an American....in a place where friends can disagree..... Have a fabulous day!!!!
8 hours ago
Doug Hansel:
The Bill is called H.R.3200 - America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009
http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h3200/text
Not exactly light reading you will see.
Some things the government does pretty well. Would you like to have "private" police companies patrolling the street? Private Military? Private legal system protecting your freedoms?
8 hours ago
Doug Hansel:
I think we need to get behind the government and make it work for us. If it doesn't, we have no one but ourselves to blame. Saying the government isn't the answer as a blanket statement goes against the very fabric that makes this country great. Our government is precisely what makes it "great to be American" don't you agree? If not, what exactly is it?
8 hours ago
Doug Hansel:
I also have to disagree with your FDA statement. People leave the USA for treatment because they can't afford the equivalent treatment here, not because of some FDA approval issue. Did you not read the Deloitte and Touche research paper I posted above?
8 hours ago
Barbara Buntele Karraker:
Bobby, back to the original post....Thanks so much for posting it.... Ronald Reagan was a very smart man, a GREAT American and an AWESOME President...
Doug, You are a very angry negative person and I feel sorry for you... but It's nice to see people with passion...I respect your right to disagree with my views and your right to be wrong (in my ...opinion).....Why it is you can't show any repect for people with opposing views....I have tried not be disrepectful to you but I find you narrow minded and condescending.....I'm choosing not to respond to your negative nonsense anymore....Wishing you and your family nothing but the best of wishes for the future...I hope you find Peace & Happiness...In this the BEST Country on EARTH.....Pray we stay that way!!!!!
5 hours ago
Doug Hansel:
You obviously don't know me or you'd know I'm not a negative, angry person. I also don't suffer fools who spread disinformaton. I'm not angry at all, you just think I am because I've called you out for being WRONG (repeatedly with real links to facts). Why would you have me respect your opinion when it's based on falsehoods that you can't back up? I'm glad you won't respond, because I know the real reason; you have no logical basis for your argument to continue. So, you can blame it all on me and my attitude, but in truth, if your opinions could be backed up by one shred of fact, we might be able to have an actual debate.
Bye bye Barbara... don't worry, we have your best interests at heart... and that's the greatest irony of all.
3 hours ago
